Tue
Jan 05 2010

Infiniti isn't Lexus

Peter Nunn
I’ve been reading some of the web threads and letters on Infiniti of late and think it might be time to put the record straight a bit on Nissan’s luxury brand.

Even though the cars are good, Infiniti already seems to have copped all manner of flak. Observations like, it’ll never take off; BMW won’t notice or care; they’re just Datsuns in disguise and it’s going to be like Lexus all over again.



Why all the hostility?

OK, let’s take the last one first. Lest we forget, Lexus was created originally for North America where over the years it’s been hugely successful and influential (yes, even Mercedes and BMW had to sit up and take notice). Europe has been a much harder slog and 20 years on, Lexus is still mostly about refinement, comfort, quality and luxury, and now eco-friendly hybrids, of course.

Driver appeal and sportiness have never been high on the agenda - until the IS-F came along, that is. And it’s here that the two Japanese brands part company.

Infiniti most definitely is about driver appeal and sportiness, just the kind of things readers of this site and mag are wired in to. Nissan has some demon engineers who turn out good stuff like the 370Z, Skyline and GT-R and when you drive the latest Infinitis, you can feel this DNA coming through.

Yes, I know, all that on its own is not enough. Until Infiniti comes up with some new clean diesels and gets C02 down to a certain level, it’ll be a blip on the radar screens. Guess what, Nissan knows that already which is why diesel power and a new rear-drive hybrid are working their way through the system as we speak. The party starts on that next year, but - yes - really should have been there from the start…

Nissan is also clued into the badge snobbery bit, which is why it’s not making any rash promises about world domination and blowing BMW away tomorrow. It look Audi, after all, the best part of 20 years to make it into the same premium car park as BMW and Mercedes.

Nissan is sensibly starting out slow and steady and, yes, much ultimately depends on how much Carlos Ghosn invests, when the diesels and hybrids come and what the dealer experience is like.

Anyway, Infiniti is not going to be like Lexus. The cars and culture are different, with Infiniti appealing far more to the (free-thinking) petrolheads among us. An attitude like that is eminently worthy of support, I’d say.

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About Peter Nunn

Left UK to work in Japan in 1988. Lives in Tokyo, covering the Japanese car industry. Owns two Mazdas; would love a Land Rover Defender, if only it would fit in his parking space.

Comments

MattDB January 5, 2010 11:22 AM

In these cash strapped times, it will take a real leap of faith from someone financially carefree to buy into this brand.  Residuals will be poor, emissions are high so company car drivers will be punished and lease deals will be expensive.  370z's and GTR's appeal to enthusiasts who tend to spend their own money and sell in puny volume, these are halo cars for the Nissan brand.  Infinity has to stand up on its own and make money for Nissan and its dealers, even Mercedes and BMW struggle to make a profit these days and they are the kings of the luxury car fleets so all I can say is I applaud Infiniti for some excellent but irrelevant product and predict then going the same way as Cadillac europe.

My suggestion to Infiniti is for them to underwrite their used car values and give a guarantee to match the average BMW residual %,  also to include the first 3 years road tax within the deal, so at least they can offset some of the penalty of the sky high emissions.

P1MUY January 5, 2010 11:47 AM

No diesels seems a seriously dumb decision. Big Mercs, BMs, Audis, Range Rovers etc... 80% are diesel.

justi January 5, 2010 12:26 PM

I would hazard that Nissan have decided to get the dealer infrastructure sorted with low volume product before they unleash the diesel/hybrid cars likely to sell in real numbers.

theonlydt January 5, 2010 1:01 PM

I quite like Infiniti - the "cross-over sporty coupe 4x4 thing" is ugly and a bit of a joke, but some of the saloons are awesome. Now living in N.America the contractor who built our house (and hundreds others) has an Infiniti - he swears by it and I was very impressed. Said he's trying to sell his wife's Buick as it's terrible and he wants another Infinti!(Yes, I know Buick have nothing on the Merc, BMW world)

Overdrive January 5, 2010 4:15 PM

To be fair I don't think I've read many comments (if any) on the Autocar forums dismissing Infiniti as  "Datsuns in disguise".

Based on the tests I've read he various Infiniti cars appear to have a lot of ability and can give the established premium makers a run for their money.

However, I do think in order for Infiniti to start to make inroads in Europe they need to get the pricing of their cars right, because they are not exactly giving them away.

Granted, the Infiniti models tend to be much better equipped than their equivalent European rivals, but their retail prices are very close to the Europeans and, given the fact the Inifiniti as a brand is not really established in Europe (and also that their cars don't "appear" quite as well built - going by testers' observations), this could work against them.

Wanger January 5, 2010 4:34 PM

Any brand with the right amount of aspirational marketing can become a desirable object of affection.

However brands like Audi,BMW and Mercedes have the benefit of some sort of recognisable Motorsport involvement from the past or present that gives them that extra little piece of imagery and bragging rights.

Most Audi`s, Mercs or BMW`s you see, are the low end cars of the model range with no particular brilliance and quite a lot of sterility...Its normally the range toppers, with all the goodies that provide the headlines to the range and why most of the motoring press get the 300bhp versions before the comparitively mundane 200bhp versions.

Infiniti need to Motorsport program and something that the marketing men can point too and say "Our cars are better than yours....We`ve just beat your brand on the track!"

OK a luxury saloon/SUV doesnt have much relevance to this arena...But the luxury saloon/SUV buyers are normally aware of sporting achievements within F1,LeMans,FIA GT,DTM and World Touring Cars....It all helps with the branding and aspirational pictures,imagery and footfall into the dealerships and therefore sales!

kcrally January 5, 2010 5:36 PM

well its a bit like ford building a luxury car. so they bought jaguar.

then they sold jaguar. and now we have the mondeo taxi.

Wanger January 5, 2010 8:45 PM

A good example of promoting a brand, that hasnt allways been particularly seen as premium, is too look at how Audi has achieved its perceived "premium" tag. Not only has a used a cost-effective MotorSports programme that has included rallying, touring cars (in various series around the world) and its LeMans series programmes.

Audi has also used very sophisticated advertising and slogan campaigns, in conjunction with its value for money sporting programmes promoting an aspirational value to its range of what is essentially an upmarket Volkswagen.

The use of the Royal Family was a marketing coup too, plus pruduct placement within films, also the creation of its own digital TV channel furthered its cause as a premium brand....Infiniti could do well by taking a good look at the Audi "model" of brand building!

Mart_J January 6, 2010 12:28 AM

I think you all have points here. Ask most people in the 70s about an Audi and they'd laugh in your face, ask again now, and there is much cooing and cries of 'I want one'. Audi have done particularly well in the new premium brand segment even though it could be argued they don't produce 'premium' products. If Infinity want to be taken seriously in Europe and more importantly, the UK, they need to guarantee and incentivise the buyer and build some more prestige connections. Ironically, Renault could be it's saving grace with their strong motorsport programme and long-standing connections.

HyundaiSmoke January 6, 2010 9:49 AM

Lexus=Japanese Benz

Infiniti=Japanese Audi

Acura=Japanese BMW

ThwartedEfforts January 6, 2010 9:49 AM

The best sellers in this class are all diesels. I would hazard a guess that Infiniti won't sell more than a mere handful of cars this year: compare the huge 'flop' noise Cadillac made (another petrol only, US-centric nothing brand) selling fewer than 50 cars TOTAL throughout 2008. Even with hybrids in its line-up, Lexus has gotten pretty much nowhere compared to rivals and while we bemoan the UK's badge obsessiveness - does anyone think that Infiniti makes a better car, badge or no badge?

rhw0104 January 6, 2010 10:09 AM

Nissan is already part of Renault who do make some excellent diesels so nissan will prob either use the existing v6 diesel and the 180bhp 2.0 diesel but will prob work with renault to make other diesels, lets be honest the japs arent exactly well known for making good diesel engines for that you need the french and the germans.

roverfan1984 January 6, 2010 7:54 PM

@ "Lexus has gotten pretty much nowhere compared to rivals"

They might not sell as many cars as their rivals (if you mean BMW, Audi, Mercedes), but they are probably glad about that. Look at Audi- they have now become two-a-penny & their brand has suffered as a result- there are a lot of negative connotations about Audis now which didnt exist 10 years ago. Same with BMW.

If I was the boss of Lexus I would not be trying to increase sales at all, to protect the exclusivity of the brand. Theyve got an incredibly high reputation & a loyal, satisfied customer base, that will carry on buying Lexuses forever & ever. Id say Lexus is a huge success story!

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