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Wed
May 28 2008

By accident or design?

Andrew Frankel

For reasons too boring to explain, I did a lap of the M25 on Monday, every mile of which took place in rain of biblical proportions. In that time I saw six single car accidents. One was a knackered old Cavalier and another an even older Mazda MX-5. But the remaining four, from a Range Rover to a Porsche 911 were all in their youth and had one other thing in common: four-wheel drive.

Crash Coincidence? I think not. I was driving a modern rear-wheel drive car and after a few flashes of the traction control light, I was left under no illusions as to the available grip levels. If I’d had four-wheel drive, I doubt I’d have had a clue. That’s one problem. The second is the morons who so often drive all-wheel-drive cars, convinced an extra pair of drive shafts somehow grants them immunity from nature. The third are car manufacturers who implicitly or otherwise market all-wheel drive as a safety system. It is not.

Before my M25 experience I asked a senior Volvo engineer what, as a representative of perhaps the most safety oriented car brand, he thought of four-wheel drive as a safety feature. His reply was interesting, particularly as Volvo sells cars both with and without four-wheel drive:AU_1870_l

‘In extreme conditions, so long as you are a skilled and sensible driver there is no question that four-wheel drive improves safety. When I go driving on snow and ice in northern Sweden, I wouldn’t be without it. But if you don’t use it properly and don’t realise its limitations, it can be less safe.’ 

Don’t misunderstand me: four wheel drive can be great if you’re towing or live down a muddy lane. But if you buy a four-wheel-drive car thinking you’ll be less likely to have an accident as a result, think again. If not treated with care and understanding, one of the more notable things four-wheel drive will do for you is raise the speed at which you finally fly off the road. It’s a phenomenon that quite a few people will have discovered on Monday. And done so the hard way.

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About Andrew Frankel

Talents are limited to "driving cars and writing English." In 19th century France he would, therefore, have been stuffed; as it is, Andrew's the perfect Autocar road test writer.

Comments

NiallOswald May 28, 2008 6:55 PM

4WD or otherwise, what would really help is people sensibly adjusting their driving habits in poor conditions. Tailgating at 85+ on the motorway is bad enough in clear daytime conditions, at night in torrential rain on an unlit motorway there's just no excuse.

Anyone who thinks they can drive a few feet from the back of another vehicle at motorway speeds (legal or otherwise) safely needs to reconsider their perceived immunity from the forces of nature!

JJBoxster May 29, 2008 1:41 AM

Some regard a tailgater as a pushy Turk. Others regard the guy being tailgated as a slug holding up a quicker driver!

Mr Frankel has seen 6 accidents in 1 trip around the M25 which is an an extraordinary amount! I think I've come across maybe 12-15 crunches in my entire lifetime.

4 of the 6 accidents were 4x4's Mr Frankel claims. Can I ask how you assertained how 4 out of 4 acidents were the 4x4's fault?

Mr Frankels extraordinarily perceptive accident analysis skills from the seat of his car are one thing. There may be something to certain vehicles attracting certain clients who have character traits that have higher risk to accidents. I certainly don't feel 'safe' in a 4x4 as many claim they feel from driving one. The higher the ride height the less secure I feel from knowing the road and its grip levels.

But the worst drivers I've found are middle-aged (30-49) overweight (approx 2 stone) women with glasses. Women supposedly have better peripheral vision (compared to men who's sight is more straight ahead and target orientated). Good peripheral vision is news to these 4-eyed women who wouldn't know if a Sherman Tank and flying flourescent pigs were sharing the motorway with them as they haven't a friggin clue what's going on around them on the road!!  

Quattro369 May 29, 2008 6:40 AM

I remember years ago seeing a very old episode of top gear or pulling power. There was a guy whose favourite hobby was driving full laps of the M25 on the weekends in his Vauxhall Astra. He had done in excess of 100 laps. Wasnt you Andrew by any chance was it?

chandrew May 29, 2008 7:57 AM

Here in Switzerland 4WD, especially in 'normal' cars is far more common - witness all the x-drive 3 series or 4matic E classes.  If you have an interest in getting to the nearest ski resort before the snow-plough can then it's the only obvious solution.

Driving a lot on slippery conditions I'd say 4WD is a real help, especially in the powerful, discrete estates that the Swiss love.  All of us can sometimes put the power down too early after a corner and I'd much rather control a gentle drift than a RWD oversteer on a busy road.  It'll also get you out of a car-park after a heavy fall.

What doesn't change whatever wheels are being driven is the stopping distance.  It's absolutely true that many 'new' 4WD drivers think that they have all-round better control and leave braking too late.  Your observation would seem to demonstrate that.

Ultimately it's all related to inexperience as a driver, and the only real way to overcome this is education / practice.  The safe way is on a skid pan.  An alternative is a snow-covered mountain pass with steep drops and no barriers.  It's amazing what a bit of fear does to the senses.

David Harrington-Wright May 29, 2008 10:29 AM

The type of car is probably irrelevant in 9/10 of accidents - its down to poor driving on their part or other road users.

Soshko May 29, 2008 12:53 PM

Sometimes I wonder if people who buy the large SUV type of 4x4 as opposed to Subarus etc are actually timid drivers & are scared of the normal driving experience. They have these things as a kind of motoring security blanket and think they are unstoppable. Except, that is when the snow falls - they are usually at the head of a very slow moving queue.

NiallOswald May 29, 2008 10:02 PM

The thing with tailgating is that no matter how justifiable it may seem, it doesn't make it any less dangerous. There's just no excuse for not maintaining safe distance, all the time, no matter how annoyed you are with the driver in front. When you run into the back of the car in front 'he was doing 80 and I wanted to be doing 100' isn't really going to wash...

Gassed Up May 29, 2008 10:51 PM

Frankel seems to have a real downer on 4WD all of a sudden, as he is peddling this view across a number of mags - perhaps the "M25" experience has given him sleepless nights. Or maybe he's just fed up with seeing giant Q7's clogging up our roads (and I would agree with him).

However, in terms of 4WD being a near-useless technology, I think he's lost the plot.  4WD has the basic dynamic advantage over 2WD in that it distributes the accelerative forces across all four wheels. So when you add more power, any of the 4 tyres that aren't at the limit of grip will be used to accelerate the car, rather than trying to achieve this with only 2. Rally cars are 4WD for a reason.

This results in a vehicle which can generate more tractive effort, and which has a lower rate of yaw when the acceleration limit in a bend is reached, because the forces are more evenly distributed between front and rear axles. I think it is fair to regard these as dynamic advantages which can be used as extra safety margins.

However, how these dynamic advantages are used is still down to the driver. If they use up the extra safety margin to just drive faster, then yes they may have an accident at a higher speed. But surely that's the driver's fault, not the car's. Otherwise you'd have to conclude that the lower the grip, the safer the car...???!!!

In a situation such as exiting out of a side street onto a busy main road in the wet, 4wd is going to give you a significant safety advantage, all other things being equal. Even over 2WD with traction control, because T/C still only has 2 tyres to work with.

In terms of braking or ultimate steady state cornering, it confers no advantage. And the biggest dynamic safety aid is surely electronic stability, since this is an active system that attempts to stop the car losing grip despite what the driver does! But I can't see that any of this is a reason to condemn 4WD as being worthless or misleading.

Then again, perhaps his next post will be on the dangers of ABS.....

JJBoxster May 30, 2008 1:26 AM

In terms of traction 4WD offers small but significant advantages mainly in the wet (it's hard to exceed a 2WD cars traction in the dry even in powerful cars).

But traction/accelration isn't the same as safety. My 4WD 996 Turbo didn't really offer any better 'safety' in the wet than my Boxsters though I've never driven the 'wildcat' GT2 to compare properly.

The most significant safety feature is ABS brakes that allow you to steer and brake like your life depended on it. On two occassions I've used this 'facility' in anger and was quite staggered by its awesome capability.  

Returning to the issue of 4WD and high accident rates - if there is a link it's the drivers. But pigeon holing 4WD drivers as unsafe I think is pretty rediculous as there's no defined 'group' for 4WD's in my experience. The insurance industry would cotton on quickly if there was and never one's to hold back on a sliver of a reason to jack up premiums I think they'd be on the case by now.

Interesting that a recent survey of F1 accident rates since the removal of traction and other 'safety aids' have not resulted in any rise in racing accidents. Just shows human skill and accident rates, even in 2WD 800bhp missiles driven to the knife edge of safety limts, don't need technological aids to avoid accidents.  

x838nwy May 30, 2008 12:42 PM

Imo, it is certainly acceptable to view 4wd as a 'safety' feature, specially when it is coupled to a fairly intelligent control system.

However, the point is that it is never a good idea to use a safety net as a landing pad as it were. Yes, it provides better traction in the wet and so on, but it really shouldn't be thought of as something that will allow you to forget the laws of physics.

I mean, we can all agree airbags are a good idea, but I'm sure we'll also agree that it's not entirely wise to drive more dangerously just because we have airbags. On wet, slippery and greasy conditions, I'm sure most would very much prefer a 4wd car than a rwd car. But that should be from the point of view that we'd more comfortably (and more likely to) keep it between the hedges and not so we could go faster.

ThwartedEfforts May 30, 2008 1:52 PM

Ugh.

For the clowns writing about "dynamic advantage" and "tractive effort", this post is about the effect of 4WD on drivers, not the effectiveness of 4WD itself.

Does anyone actually read and understand articles on web sites any more, or merely isolate and deconstruct particular sentences they want to get angry about?

JJBoxster May 30, 2008 2:30 PM

Thwarted - have you got a point? Surely the issue made by posters is that 4WD adds a smidgen of safety here and there and that there's no reason/evidence 4x4 drivers are any more accident prone than anyone else which Mr Frankelis purporting.

I'm still waiting for an answer on how Mr Frankel asessed 4 out 4 accidents were the 4x4's fault from the throne-like position of his passing car!

Surely if posters can "isolate and deconstruct sentances" in an article they have some problem understanding this is a good thing - better than swallowing any old clap-trap - I'm sure journos much prefer being kept on their toes in the new internet age rather than the old printed article that disappears into a void called 'the readership' with the odd faint echo back.  

edeath May 30, 2008 3:31 PM

JJ - The article did point out that these were single car accidents, therefore in all likelyhood the 4x4 drivers fault.

And while everyone is going on about the type of people who drive 4x4s - it is the marketing of 4x4 as a safety system that is the problem.

The people who drive 4x4s who dont have a physical need for the drivetrain are the sort of people who dont actually know a huge amount about cars.

The problem is that with a 4x4 drivetrain you get more traction. However when that traction is broken you are going to have a much bigger accident than when the traction is broken in a 2wd car.

Its the same as giving a rwd car an limited slip diff. You will get better traction than on an identical car without it, but when the traction is broken the back is going to go a hell of a lot worse than in the car without the lsd when it loses traction.

In essence the manufacturers should not be pimping 4wd as a saftey feature because it will make a crash due to lack of traction that much worse due to the extra speed being carried by the vehicule.

ThwartedEfforts May 30, 2008 7:26 PM

JJBoxster -

Asking me what my point was merely reinforces everything I said.

For the short of attention: how is exploiting a 4WD's drive system any different to exploiting a sports car's engine and brakes? If the manner in which you drive is a result of merely knowing about, but not understanding, what your car can do then the likelihood of you coming to grief will be very high.

In addition, and contrary to what you say, there is mounting evidence to back up Mr Frankel's notion and from sources all round the world:

4WD drivers really as bad as we thought

(Sydney Morning Herald)

"A person behind the wheel of [a 4WD vehicle] is far more likely to be wielding a mobile phone while driving, and less likely to wear a seatbelt, researchers say. They have concluded that four-wheel-drive owners take more risks because they feel safer."

Higher crash risk for teenagers in 4WDs

(RACQ)

"New research from the Monash University Accident Research Centre shows that teenagers in four-wheel-drives are at a much greater risk of crashing than those driving other vehicles."

And so on.

Of course, none of this corresponds with your worldview, so I have no doubt the discussion won't end here...

Beowolf May 30, 2008 11:50 PM

What a bad Monday.   Biblical rain leads to biblical level of accidents.  

Agreed, if people perceive 4wd as an added safety feature, they'll possibly drive faster thinking they have a higher safety margin, especially in trecherous conditions, in which 4wd is meant to be - and I'm sure it is - generally safer.   As many have pointed out, that means when the off does happen, the speeds will be higher...

There was a terrific article many moons ago how increased 'safety' levels in cars mean people take higher risks, maintaining a safety/risk equation which stays roughly the same.  I can imagine that including 4wd.  To be honest, I reckon I'd be just the same....

This would mean most Volvo drivers should drive a bit quiker...?   And to be honest, SOME Mercedes drivers baffle the heck out of me.  They seem to be cocooned/isolated from the rest of the world...

Drive/Ride safe ;-0)

JJBoxster May 31, 2008 2:18 AM

Edeath - Mr Frankel has not pointed out anything about the 4x4's on the M25 except in his accident analysis from his passing car he's assumed the 4x4 drivers (4 out 4) was their fault. Did they hit the barrier because another car lane changed in front of them.. we don't know.

And unless Mr Frankel stopped at each one to ask the police for their opinion I'd be stunned if he came to the right conclusion on ach one as there's many a reason for accidents and driver error has about a 1 in 4 or 5 chance.

The extra traction/acerlartion between a 4WD and 2WD is largely irrelevant. 4WD weighs say 40-60kg more than a 2WD system. The extra traction is countered by a weight penalty. I saw an Audi test 5yrs ago and the 4WD was about 1.5% t 3% quicker round a wet track with little difference in the dry.

If you'd seen the 911 v R8 Quarter Mile on Top Gear you'd have noticed the 2WD Carrera S was actually quicker off the mark and over the first 50 yards than the 4WD Audi. I really don't see anyone driving a 4WD any quicker than a 2WD.

I'll ignore both your surveys conclusions of "much greater risk" because like any survey that doesn't come out with actual figures you can "with very high confidence" assume they're talking rubbish. Please provide the crash figures not airy-fairy assumptions by researchers.

JJBoxster May 31, 2008 2:41 AM

Thwarted - I should ignore both your surveys conclusions of "much greater risk" because like any survey (or politician) with bland  scare statements like that avoiding stating the actual facts and figures you can "with very high confidence" assume they're talking rubbish. Please provide the crash rates, not airy-fairy assumptions by researchers, if they have them!!

What I want to see is of 3 accidents per Billion Kilometers if the accident rates amoung 4WD owners are significantly higher, say 30 accidents p.b.km.

How you assume 4WD drivers are any worse at knowing their vehicles limits than anyone else is beyond my understanding. Accident rates show people are extremely safe. 4WD drivers are a motley and varied crew, from racing drivers to Mums to businessmen.

Maybe you have a crystal ball for telling accident rates for Golf drivers, Boxster drivers and Nissan Quashqis? You could earn a fortune in the insurance industry as could Mr Frankel.

We all take risks in cars in many different ways but we all avoid accidents as we've a 'safety alert system' fine tuned over a 100,000 years like any animal to take but avert a high risk situation into becoming an accident.

Researchers can research and hypothasise however much they like. But the facts are Mobile phones make next to zero difference to accident rates, holding a mobile has no difference to a hands free, and wearing a seatbelt is a risk with a 3 in 100,000,000 chance of being a 'high risk'. Namely your researcher is talking 99,999,997 kilometers of crap.

ThwartedEfforts May 31, 2008 1:13 PM

My assumptions are backed up with statistics. Yours are based on what sounds right to you.

Here's Frankel's hypothesis in a nutshell, courtesy of facts from the BMJ:

"Drivers of four wheel drive vehicles were four times more likely than drivers of other cars to be seen using hand held mobile phones and slightly more likely not to comply with the law on seat belts."

bmj.bmjjournals.com/.../71

The sample size was 40,000 cars in London and the statistics relating to 4WD are what they call 'significant'. Whether you happen to agree with the laws is irrelevant, the fact is that the number of 4WD drivers ignoring them is remarkably high.

But of course, all research is "crap" unless you post it.

JJBoxster May 31, 2008 5:10 PM

Thwarted - I'm a big fan of research, but of facts not fiction. There's real research and there's government croney research to scare and misrepresent.

The difference not detected by the nieve and inexperienced like you is between the person that states holding a Mobile actually increases accidents from 3 crashes to 12 crashes per billion kilometers and other research (ie. your study) that says "Drivers of 4WD's were four times more likely than drivers of other cars to be seen using hand held mobile.."

The first is a statement of fact. Your reseach is a supposition. Not a fact.

Increased risk is not important. What is important is actual outcome. Drivers take risk, increase risk but the facts show they are incredibly safe (3 accidents per Billion km's).

The supposition carrying a Mobile increases 'CHANCE' of accidents is b*llocks if the outcome does not happen (ie. becomes a fact).

You research says "you're 4 times more likley to be seen using hand held mobile phones (4WD 8.2% v 2.0% 2WD) and not complying with the law on seat belts (4WD 19.5% v 15.0% 2WD). So what?

Jon Hardcastle June 5, 2008 4:59 PM

Maybe this is a case of people like sheep will follow the crowd. In many cases I suspect that the cars in question will have a premium badge and have been bought on that basis and oh, by the way, it has 4WD. I can see the argument for buying a car that places them higher, therfore, being able to see further ahead, but what about whats directly in front.

This boils down to driving standards and within the limitations of oneself. When all said and done in the vast majority of situations the drivers limits are reached before the cars limits are.

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